On Krishnamurti and Osho: You cannot reject the world while holding on to yourself

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Listener: In one of the discourses by Osho, he was asked, “Why Jiddu Krishnamurti could not get people Sanyas?” And he answers it like this,  “Krishnamurti is on my side. We are both saying the same things. Krishnamurti was against dogmas, beliefs, organized religion and all that which is ‘symbolic’, which is not real. But he said the egoist man will find Krishnamurti on his side because he cannot surrender to anyone. An egoist mind is not likely to be able to transcend or be a spiritual man because he would not find it easy to surrender to anyone. I don’t understand what he is trying to say by that.

Somewhere I see a connect with what you are trying to say but I am not reaching somewhere.

Acharya Prashant: Let me put it very clearly.

It is not true at all that the egoist mind does not surrender to anybody. It is not at all true! Where does ego come from? The ego itself comes from somewhere and somebody, the so-called surrendered man and the so-called egoist are just the same, the difference is only in the expression and this has to be very meticulously listened to.

The man who goes and surrenders to the priest is conscious that he is surrendering to the priest. He is conscious that he is allowing the priest to dominate him, to dictate his mental activity and consciousness, and then there is the egoist, the egoist says, ‘I am resisting the priest.’

Now when he is saying that he is resisting the priest, is this his own statement? Where does ego come from? Ego comes from outside, right? Ego is—I am something and this something is outside. When you are given an identity statement from somewhere that is ego. Right? Now the egoist man is saying I will not surrender to the priest. Now, is this the voice of his heart or is this something that he has been tutored in?

Come on please! So, when he is saying I am not surrendering to the priest he has already surrendered to someone else he does not know. The so-called surrendered man is conscious that he is allowing himself to be dominated by the priest. The egoist man is not even conscious that somebody is dominating his mind.

You see, I could be a religious fanatic and you are coming to me and trying to drill some sense into my mind, right? And I pull out my gun and say, ‘I will not listen to you, I will not surrender to you.’ Does that mean I am a free man or a free mind? No, that only means that my mind has been totally enslaved by an ideology, by a tradition, by somebody behind me.

So, even though I appeared to be resisting you, the fact is that I am enslaved by somebody else but if you will look only at the small picture then you will feel Oh! This is an expression of some kind of freedom. No, it is not an expression of some kind of freedom. It only means that my master is somewhere else. But it is still a worldly master, it is still a material master—a man, a thought, a belief, an ideology, something.

Are you getting it?

When you really rebel, then you rebel not only against all that which controls you from the outside but you also rebel against that which controls you from the inside.

You see there can be two ways to control you:

  • Either through explicit fear; I may point a gun at you and say, ‘Come on do this.’
  • Or, the other more cunning and more nefarious way of controlling you is that I condition your mind.

Now even without using a gun, even without displaying open violence, I am controlling you, this is the egoist—This is the egoist who is being controlled by others internally and he thinks that he is free he says, ‘I am not surrendering to the external.’ He does not even know that he has already been crawling on his knees internally. So when I am saying rebel, I am saying rebel not only against the world but also against yourself.

When Krishnamurti said there is no authority, he does not said you are the authority.

He said nobody can be an authority including you.

So then only Truth is the authority.

When the world is not an authority, when you are not an authority then nothing is an authority. Then that which is nothing and hence the Truth is the authority.

Total rebellion is hence total surrender.

Remember, not partial rebellion, partial rebellion would mean I am resisting the outside but I am totally blind and oblivious to the inside—This is partial rebellion. Partial rebellion is extremely fake convenient and self-destructive.

When you rebel and I meet so many young people, young professionals, young students and rebellion is often a topic that comes up. I say you all like rebelling but don’t rebel in small ways—strikes, protest, missing classes, general hooliganism, vandalizing property—all these are minor rebellions.

If you must rebel, rebel totally.

And that total rebellion is spirituality. That total rebellion is surrender.

L1: So, do you mean, for example that when one priest is there and I am not living in an organized religion And I see a herd lying some front to front and since I am a rebel, So I say, ‘Why are you in that herd because I am against organized religion.’ So by rebellion it means getting over this voice also? And consider the God in priest as well?

AP: Yes.. Yes..Of, course. Or, God nowhere.

The first part is alright, that you realize that the voice coming from within is also an external voice. You know, these so-called voices of the mind and voices of the conscience, we take them as our voices. The fact is all voices coming from anywhere are all external so the first part was alright that even this resistance is an external resistance; a resistance is externally imposed upon me—that much is alright.

But the second part you said that ‘And hence, I must say that there is God in the priest also so that I may bow to him without any harm’—NO. Because this is a definite thought and all definite thought will be conditioned thoughts. You have to stop at saying that while the pressure of the herd, that the herd as you know, is indirectly imposing on me to come to the priest is an external pressure. Even this internal voice is an external pressure and you have to stop, the moment you say this, after this you don’t say anything.

After this there would be spontaneous action. So you need not say what you just said that hence I can go to priest thinking that he is God. No, you need not think anything; you just have to stop and that is surrender. Having realized falseness I stopped because now there is nothing left to do. I stopped and then the divine takes over.

Once I stop, then action happens on its own, then I may go the priest or I may run away or I may sit still or I may start jumping or I may do nothing.

Who knows?

The ways of divinity are incomprehensible. Why will I try to preordain them? Now this is challenging, if you think of it, it is challenge.

L2: Yes, challenging because who do you listen to? That voice you are ignoring and there is an inertia?

AP: Yes.

L2: It is actually making me feeling nervous.

AP: Yes, if you think about it.

Faith is about acting without the support of thought.

Faith uses thought just as an instrument not as a support. 

That is the difference.

The ordinary mind uses thought as the bull work, as the foundation. The faithful mind may also think but for the faithful mind thought is just a slave; an instrument.

Are you getting it?

So just stop.


Excerpts from a ‘Shabd-Yoga’ session. Edited for clarity.

Watch the session: Acharya Prashant on Krishnamurti and Osho: You cannot reject the world while holding on to yourself


Further Reading:

Book of Myths

myth-for-blogThis is the most challenging book one can ever come across. It will questions all the popular beliefs one harbours. Never imposing itself on the reader, at the same time the book facilities a thorough enquiry of popular knowledge which is blindly accepted as an obvious fact. It demolishes our so called holy concepts.

If you are someone who has read anything on self-help or on spirituality this book is a must for cleaning of spiritual information.

Paperback: https://goo.gl/VVD8Yg

Kindle: https://goo.gl/VsIucH

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3 thoughts on “On Krishnamurti and Osho: You cannot reject the world while holding on to yourself

  1. I am completely lost and no where to turn to that can save me from death… and the only thing I see that has any meaning is the actual DEATH… The Grand destroyer of all ignorance. Like a disease that has to be terminated, men has to be completely ANNIHILATED.

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  2. Further on: The only thing that will save mankind is voluntarily suicide!!! For the simple reason that once the mind contemplates over it’s end, all satisfactions for any other discovery – also END… and finally men gets liberated not by wanting to find, but by loosing and discarding All they have brought to light, and this is what Gurus should preach… DEATH AND HOW TO DIE.

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    • Dear HollowLife,

      Greetings from PrashantAdvait Foundation!

      The reply to this comment is made by the volunteers of the foundation, who maintain the blog.

      When a saint or a Guru says, “Death” he has a totally different perspective on that. It is not the physical death that we see. To read more on it:

      https://prashantadvait.com/2014/09/28/the-imaginary-fear-of-death/

      https://prashantadvait.com/2016/11/01/joy-is-the-love-affair-of-life-with-death/

      We are glad to inform you that seekers from all over the world get connected with Acharya-Ji through the following offerings by the foundation:

      1. Meet the Master:
      Meet the Master aka MTM is an opportunity to meet Acharya Prashant personally, either physically or online.

      To meet the master, send your application to requests@prashantadvait.com or contact: Smt. Anoushka Jain: +91-9818585917

      2. Advait Learning Camps:
      Advait Learning Camps are monthly retreats organized by PrashantAdvait Foundation under Acharya Prashant’s guidance. These camps are about spending four days and three nights in the lap of nature, while reading, reflecting, learning and evolving.
      So far, scores of ALCs have been organised in places like Rishikesh, Mukteshwar, Jim Corbett National Park, Chopta, Kainchi Dham, etc.

      To participate in the camp, write an e-mail to requests@prashantadvait.com, or call: Sh. Anshu Sharma at +91-8376055661

      3. Course in Realization:
      Course in Realization, a classroom-based learning program led by Acharya Prashant, is a humanitarian initiative towards disseminating clarity and intelligence in the world. In this course, a rigorous study of a scripture or a saint is undertaken each month.

      To join in, send your application to requests@prashantadvait.com or contact: Sh. Apaar: +91-9818591240

      4. Month of Awakening:
      For those who cannot attend sessions physically, the foundation does online streaming of few selected sessions via Skype or Webinar. Known as Month of Awakening, this facility offers live streaming of sessions and helps seekers listen to Acharya-Ji while being where they are.

      To receive the blessing, send your application to requests@prashantadvait.com or contact:
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      Shubhakankshi
      PrashantAdvait Foundation

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